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Rain Commodities - Check this cement gem

Printed From: The Equity Desk
Category: Investment Ideas - Creating winning portfolios!
Forum Name: Stock Synopsis
Forum Discription: A bried discussion of companies on very specific matters. Normally this is the prelude for further research as always members would be discussing quality companies with good management only
URL: http://www.theequitydesk.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=140
Printed Date: 02/May/2025 at 9:07pm


Topic: Rain Commodities - Check this cement gem
Posted By: basant
Subject: Rain Commodities - Check this cement gem
Date Posted: 10/Aug/2006 at 12:10pm

Rain Commodities (Rs 114 )–  Check this Cement gem.

 

Rain Commodities Ltd. (CMP Rs.114 )  Previously known as Priyadarshani Cement RCOL has an installed capacity to produce 1.40 mn ton of cement. As with other cement plants this capacity can be over utilized by 10 % to produce up to 1.55 million tonnes of cement..  The company derives more then 50% of its revenue from cement sales in Andhra Pradesh alone while the balance portion is sold in the adjoining states of southern India.

South India is the largest cement consumption and dispatch region in India.  The cement consumption of south India region was 29% of overall Indian cement consumption in FY2006.

 
The upswing in interest rate cycle during the second half of the 90’s affected all the over leveraged companies of India Inc. Rain commodities was no exception. The company ran into losses with mounting debt and decreasing cement demand.
 
In April 2005, Rain commodities company allotted 50,00,000 Equity Warrants to both Citigroup and the  promoters. These warrants were to be converted into equity shares after 18 months.  Citigroup also invested Rs. 115 crores in the debentures of Rain Industries. 
 

Market price

114

No. of shares

2.31 crores

Market Capitalization (prior to conversion of warrants)

Rs 263.34 crores

Sales (FY 07)E

Rs 410 crores

EPS( FY 07)E [post warrant conversion]

Rs 28.00

PE

4.07

Installed Capacity

1.4 million tonnes

Global Valuations

US $100 per ton per anum

Indian Valuations

USD $ 175 per ton per anum

Enterprise value at Global Valuations

Rs 646 crores (Rs 201 per share)

Enterprise value at Indian Valuations

Rs 1131 crores (Rs 352 per share)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 
 
 
The conversion of warrants shall increase the equity to Rs 32.11 crores. This expanded equity has been computed to evaluate the enterprise value. The EPS and sales figure are average brokerage estimates. During the last quarter of previous year the company’s interest cost was Rs 5.44 crores against an interest outgo of Rs 30 crores for the nine month previous to this quarter. The increase in profits are being attributed to
 
  Ř       Better sales realization

Ř       Control of costs due to reduction in interest, savings on energy and implementation of VAT.

 
Citigroup will hold close to 14% stake in the company and that should rerate the PE upwards from the present level of 4.21 times Fy 07.

Recently, company paid USD 123 million to acquire 20.22% stake in Great Lake Carbon of U.S.A.  Great Lakes is the biggest producer of CPC in the world having 23% of the global market.  CPC is required in industries such as aluminum, steel, titanium dioxide, and other carbon consuming industries Rain calcining a group company is the fifth largest producer of CPC in the world.

Research Firm Motilal Oswal believes that merging the two entities, Rain Calcining with RCOL is very much possible. This merger will create synergies of operations, reduction in administrative costs and more importantly a higher EPS.

 
Market grapevine has it that RCOL is likely to increase its cement capacity to 4.5 million ton by 2008.
 
Recommendation: Valuations of Rain Commodities are very cheap both on the PE basis and also on the EV  per ton basis. While the large caps are trading at PE’s of 18 and above Rain Commodities trades at a PE of below 5 times Fy 07 earnings. As with all turnarounds the company appears to be at an inflexion point and needs to be bought at the present level and added on declines. The scrip should double in about 12 to 18 months..


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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in



Replies:
Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 22/Aug/2006 at 10:44pm
i have purchased a good number of shares at 114...now it has started its upmove.thanks a lot for the timely advice.
cheers.
adityan.


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 28/Aug/2006 at 11:49pm

Sun 1313: Rain commodities is traded in the name of priyadarshani Cement. The stock was frozen at Rs 139.40 today.Market rumours have it that Motilal Oswal has bought out a buy report on this stock and has been advising  clients into it.



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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 30/Aug/2006 at 3:28pm

yes sir, i know.now it is at 144....i am thinking of buying more in cement space...would u advise me to buy more of rain commodities, at this rate?.should i wait for correction or look at other stocks in cement?can u suggest any other turnaround stock in cement ?



Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 30/Aug/2006 at 3:53pm
Indian cement companies are trading at over US $ 150 per tonne. The operating margins are very high and that is a therat because cement is after all a commodity.
 
Rain at Rs 112 looked cheap and that is why I was upbeat on it. I would advise you to hold on to the initial quantity rather then buy more at these levels.
 
The fair value of Rain is above Rs 200 and the discount is narrowing so enjoy the ride and hold on and at dips we could think of buying again.. 


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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 30/Aug/2006 at 4:33pm
Thanks a lot basantji for the prompt reply...i am amazed at the speed of you reply.


Posted By: manjari
Date Posted: 03/Sep/2006 at 10:03am
cement stock is too cyclical stock and since cyclical stocks r not ur cup of tea how do u reccommend it (rain com)

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student


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 03/Sep/2006 at 10:29am

I do not favour cyclicals because it needs a great deal of timing. If you get in at the top then the waiting (pain) period could be as long as 3 - 5 years.On the other hand if you get the timing right and enter at the bottom of the cycle then things could change very fast and you could make multiple gains.The room for error is very limited.

ANyway http://www.theequitydesk.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=140 - Rain Commodities did look cheap on EV/Ton basis when I first discussed it at Rs 111. At 144 it does not include very expensive but the discount seems to be narrowing. As per global valuations the stock should hit Rs 201 and if we look at the way deals are being struck here it should be up to Rs 352 but the risks have increased and the margin of safety reduced.


-------------
'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 05/Sep/2006 at 3:19pm
basant sir, there is a news of rain commidities being merged with rain industries...your views now sir?...is it a buy at this level now?


Posted By: patnitin
Date Posted: 05/Sep/2006 at 3:34pm

Hi Mr.Basant,

Does rain calcining also belong to the same group?What are its prospects?I bought at 20 a couple of years ago and booked partial profit at 40.Should I still hold on?


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 05/Sep/2006 at 4:56pm

The merger should help both companies but I would suggest that you hold on to rain commodities only.



-------------
'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 05/Sep/2006 at 8:40pm
ok sir, thanks as always!


Posted By: prosperity
Date Posted: 06/Sep/2006 at 10:50pm
Isn't India Cements a good buy ?
A better buy than rain commodities ?
 
 


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 06/Sep/2006 at 11:06pm
Rain was locked at ciircuit at Rs 153 today so the risk reward is falling.. I would not suggest either Rain nor India Cement now. This is so because  with cement as with all cylcial stocks have to be sold. we cannot keep it.
 
Otherwise I would prefer Shree Cement to india Cement.


-------------
'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sunilpune
Date Posted: 09/Sep/2006 at 9:33pm
dear basant ji already very early recco .inaddition to that just more information .artical is not mine  but good to read .hence posting
 
thanks
 

The most spectacular turnaround in Cement Industry

Rain Commodities Ltd. (Rs. 150/-):

Indian Cement Industry is the second largest market in the world after China. Cement being a basic building material, its output is directly related to the state of the construction business in general in the economy, essentially it tracks the overall economic situation.  Indian cement consumption has a strong positive correlation of 1.2 - 1.3x with the Indian GDP.  The per capita consumption of cement in India is 122 Kg. against the world average of around 320 Kg.

 

It has installed capacity of 160 mn TPA and total consumption of 135 mn TPA for FY2006.  It also exported around 9 mn TPA of cement and clinker for FY2006.  Cement demand is expected to remain buoyant due to government thrust on infrastructure investment (in road, ports and hydropower) and rising housing demand due to lower cost of finance, fiscal benefits on housing loans, favourable demography, rising disposable income and preferred nuclear family system.  On conservative basis industry is expected to grow at a CAGR of 9% over FY2006 - FY2008E taking total demand to 168 mn TPA by end of FY2008E.  With no major capacity addition coming for next 2 years, cement prices are expected to remain strong.  The recent Govt. intervention did not seem to have any impact on cement prices on the grounds which are determined by the current demand and supply scenarios.  Capacity utilization levels close to 96% and incremental capacities being absorbed by buoyant demand would boost earnings for cement companies despite rise in freight and raw material costs.

 

Demand Supply (mn ton)

FY2006 (cr.)

FY2007E (cr.)

FY2008E (cr.)

FY2009E (cr.)

Annual Installed Capacity

159.8 

168.9

190.0

202.0

Cement Effective Capacity

157.1

161.3

177.3

197.7

Capacity utilisation required 

92.1

96.6

94.8

91.9

Cement Domestic Demand

135.6

147.8

161.1

175.6

Cement Exports

9.2

8.0

7.0

6.0

Total Cement Demand

144.8

155.8

168.1

181.6

 

Southern Region Cement Snapshot

 

South India is the largest of the five regions in terms of both consumption and dispatches of cement in India.  The cement consumption of South India region was 29% of overall Indian cement consumption in FY2006. Capacities in the South now operate at 90% (80% in FY2005) with a sharp 24% growth in consumption in FY2006 to 41 mn TPA.  High growth in the region was due to the increased focus of Andhra Govt. in irrigation projects, the Tamil Nadu Govt. on rural roads, high construction activity in the all major metros (Bangalore, Chennai and Hyderabad), development activity in Tier-II cities like Mangalore, Cochin, Vizag and Coimbatore, stress on infrastructure development, minimal capacity additions in the next two years and relaxation in tax structure.  We expect 9.5% growth in consumption in FY2007 - 2008 in the region.  With little capacities slated to come on stream over the next 2 - 3 years in the region we expect demand - supply balance to continue driving up cement prices.  In view of same, we recommend to buy RCOL as the Best Buy.

 

History:  Earlier known as Priyadarshini Cement Ltd., it had come out with IPO in 1986.  RCOL has installed capacity to produce 1.40 mn ton cement at its 2 plants in A.P.  Company sells 60% of its production in A.P.  Rest is sold in Karnataka and T.N.  It started making losses in late 90's due to heavy debt burden and poor demand situation in South.  So, later, a scheme of arrangement was worked out under which cement business was hived off into a separate company called Rain Inds.  Rain Inds. issued shares for Rs. 76 crs. at a premium of Rs. 42/- per share.  With this, RCOL became holding for Rain Inds.  This scheme was worked out to avoid the reference to BIFR.  Still, company was making losses due to .low realization, higher interest costs and low capacity utilization.  Due to working capital crunch, company was unable to stock enough R/M and had to pay higher price for spot purchase.

 

Citigroup as strategic partner:

 

In April 2005, company allotted 5 mn Equity Warrants to Citigroup and 5 mn Warrants to promoters at Rs. 40/- for each Warrant with option to convert into Equity Shares within a period of 18 months.  Citigroup also invested Rs. 115 crs. in debentures issued by Rain Inds.  The proceeds were used to settle and restructure loans of certain banks, as a part of CDR scheme. CDR also approved reduction in interest rate from 13% to 9.5%.

 

Financial Performance:

 

 

FY06

Q4FY06

 

C O N S O L I D A T E D

Net Sales

320.00

111.00

Interest 

35.30

5.44

Depreciation

14.62

3.68

Net Profit/Loss

- 4.96

9.45

EPS (Rs.)

-

4.27

 

For FY06, company reported Net Sales of 320 crs.  After providing nearly 15 crs. for depreciation, Net Loss was 4.96 crs.  However, company managed to report cash profit of 9.70 crs.  It may be noted that in Q4 alone, company made NP of 9.45 crs.  Many factors contributed to such sharp turnaround:

 

a)    Q4 interest cost was 5.44 crs. whereas, interest cost for 9M was 30 crs. which means, 10 cr. per quarter for earlier 3 quarters.

b)    Sales Realization improved by Rs. 15 - 17 per bag.

c)    Reduction in energy cost.

d)    Savings due to implementation of VAT.

Q4EPS was 4.27 which gave Annualized EPS of 17.

 

FUTURE SCENARIO:-

Huge Demand - Supply Gap

Cement demand in the country is growing at approx. 1.5 times GDP growth rate.

The cement inds. is expected to grow at a CAGR of 10% in the near term on account of housing demand and the increased thrust on infrastructure development and industrial projects.  The initiatives taken under the National Highway Programme for building highways and roads, the Pradhan Mantri Gram Sadak Yojana for constructing concrete roads in rural areas and Bharat Nirman for promoting irrigation, water supply, roads, housing are likely to be major drivers for cement demand.

I expect a cement deficit till atleast FY08, as incremental demand will exceed incremental supply.

The Govt. has decided to give a major thrust to highway and road development.  Among the major projects currently underway are:

*    The Golden Quadrilateral Project (5846 Km) expected completion Dec. 2006.

*    North - South - East - West Corridor (7300 Km) expected completion 2008.

*    48 new road projects (10,000 Kms) expected completion 2008.

All these projects are expended to lead to increased demand for cement.  It is estimated that the projects currently underway will require upto 3 MTPA of cement alone.

 

Housing Demand

India faces shortfall of around 20 mn dwelling units, but only 1.5 mn units are being built every year.  An average size unit of 400 sq. ft. requires 10 tons of cements and rise in per capita GDP levels will act as catalyst for housing demand.

Low per capita consumption

Though India is the second largest manufacturer of cement, per capita consumption is very low at 115 kg. p.a. which is well below international average of 260 Kg.  Hence, there exists tremendous scope for increasing consumption.

Infrastructure

Higher spending on infrastructure by the Govt. will also be a key driver in boosting demand.  The Govt. has opened the door for private player to participate in projects and is easing norms to facilitate entry of FDI into the sector.

 

Future Prospects of RCOL:

 

Q1FY07

FY07E

 

C O N S O L I D A T E D

Net Sales

122.00

460.00

Net Profit

28.20

98.00

Equity

22.11

32.11

EPS (Rs.)

12.76

30.52

P.E. Ratio

-

4.92

 

RCOL has rated capacity of 1.40 mn tons which can be utilized upto 1.50 mn tons. With increased acceptance of blended cement, RCOL has started using Fly Ash to produce blended cement which can take production level upto 1.7 mn tons.  At one time, A.P. had lowest cement prices in India.  However, now, prices have recovered sharply and average realization per bag from April 06 onwards is Rs. 130/- per bag which is highest ever in A.P.  RCOL is one of the biggest beneficiaries of this boom and has been performing extremely well, set to report bumper results in current year.

For Q1FY07 alone, RCOL reported NP of 28.20 crs. on net sales of 122 crs.  It gives Quarterly EPS of 12.76.  For Year Ended 31st March 2007, company may report NP of 98 crs.  However, Equity Warrants will be converted into Equity by Nov. 06, so, Equity will stand increased to 32.11 crs.  Even on increased Equity, EPS is likely to be 30.52.

Recently, company paid USD 123 mn to acquire 20.22% stake in Great Lake Carbon of U.S.A.  GLC is the biggest producer of CPC in the world with capacity of 24.50 lakh tons spread over 5 locations and having 23% of global CPC market.  Group Company (of RCOL) named Rain Calcining is already fifth biggest producer of CPC in the world.  At present, RCOL has nominated 2 Directors on the Board of GLC, U.S.A.  We feel that, in future, promoters may acquire another 20% of GLC which will enable them to get management control of GLC.  If it happens, Rain Group will command 28% of global CPC Market:

1)    First time, Citigroup has invested in a Indian Cement Company.  Its stake of nearly 14% will lead to excellent valuations for RCOL.

2)    Stock is trading at just 4.92 x FY07E EPS which is lowest in the cement industry.

3)    GLC stake holds great intrinsic value for the shareholders.

4)    It is not very far fetched, if, in near future, promoters decide to merge Rain Calcining with RCOL (due to GLC stake of RCOL) as combined entity will have synergy of operations, reduction in administrative costs and emergence of a consolidated financially strong entity with higher EPS.

 

New Trigger:

1)    Company is expanding its cement capacity to 3.10 mn tons at a cost of Rs. 340 crs.  Considering that ACC will spend 650 crs. for 1.50 mn ton plant in Eastern India for same capacity, capex of RCOL is extremely low.  Its being financed through internal accruals, debt and small equity dilution.  Expanded capacity should start production by Oct. 07. Again, project is being implemented extremely fast as normally, it takes 18 - 24 months to implement project of such size.

2)    Company is likely to make preferential offer of Equity Shares to Citigroup at Rs. 200 - 225 per share. We presume that Citigroup may pick up 50 mn shares at Rs. 100 crs. which will increase its Equity by 5 crs. in 07 - 08.

 

Valuations:

 

Net Profit Q1FY07 (cr.)

Equity (cr.)

EPS (Rs.)

Price  Q1(Rs.)   

P.E. Ratio (only on Q1EPS)

P.E. Ratio (Q1 EPS annualized)

Birla Corp

62.30

77.00

8.1

307.00

37.90

9.48

Deccan Cement

5.67

7.00

8.00

176.00

22.00

5.50

Mangalam Cement

18.81

28.24

6.66

176.00

26.42

6.60

Chettinad Cement

28.65

29.50

10.00

460.00

46.00

11.50

Rain Commodities

28.20

22.11

12.76

150.00

11.83

2.96

 

From the above Table, one can observe that Rain Commodities is still the cheapest cement scrip.  Its Quarterly EPS is the highest but share price is the lowest.  Companies in peer group are quoting at much higher P.E. Ratio.  Rain Commodities has the lowest P.E. Ratio.

Post expansion and post merger of Rain Calcining, RCOL will emerge as a big mid-sized company with diversified interests.  Based on our various assumptions, following may be the likely scenario:

 

 

As on 31-03-08 (cr.)

As on 31-03-09 (cr.)

Net Sales

1400.00

1700.00

Net Profit

235.00

275.00

Equity

67.00

67.00

Cement Capacity

3.10 Mn/Ton

3.10 Mn/Ton

CPC

28% of Global capacity.

28% of Global capacity

 

We can sum up that RCOL is aggressively consolidating and charting new horizons.  Current market price has considered only its current fundamentals and future prospects are yet to be given any valuations in its share price.  RCOL is set for re-rating in near future and once buying by mutual funds/FI/FII starts, it share price will enter a new orbit.

 

We estimate that RCOL may touch Rs. 225/- by Nov. 06, Rs. 300/- by March '07.  If its plans (as projected by us) remain on course, this scrip can be Rs. 500/- in less than 24 months.

By – Hemant K. Gupta

 



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sunil


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 09/Sep/2006 at 9:54pm

Thanks. But I am working on some numbers which suggest that we would be closer to the cement boom. Will post it when ever it is complete. rain was a good buy and we discussed it at Rs 111. I guess we had  a final target of exactly Rs 300 or thereabouts.

Just that this report comes out 3 weeks late and 40% up???


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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 22/Sep/2006 at 7:24pm
basantji, by the way,this stock is 'raining' U/C everyday.thanks and regards sir.(i am sitting on 56% profit in 40 days)...how do i play it now?shall i book profits??


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 22/Sep/2006 at 7:33pm
Congratulations for holding it since Rs 111. The stock has come close to our first target of Rs 200. From then on it starts to become costly till Rs 300. But generally investing does not work in such strict arithmatic it becomes diufficult to time the event. But we are reaching a point where the stock will not appear cheap!

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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 22/Sep/2006 at 7:57pm

thanks as always for the instant reply basantji.

anyhow i am prepared to see what happens... i am gonna hold on to it till the Q2 numbers come out...and then review.
 
its exciting for me as this is the first time i am sitting on such a short-term profit!


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 09/Oct/2006 at 11:02am
There are unconfirmed reports of Rain Commodities merging with Rain Calcining. If that happens this stock could reach our original target price of Rs 300.

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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 10/Oct/2006 at 2:34pm
YEAH BASANTJI
in circuit today also.
enjoying the ride.
thanks for introducing the stock at the right time.
the stock started moving from the next day i bought.
thanks again
regards
sun


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 10/Oct/2006 at 5:59pm

would the merger ratio (if and when it comes through) benefit rain commodities or rain calcining more?...what is your guess sir?



Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 10/Oct/2006 at 6:37pm
It is yet very fluid. But I would advice you not to think very long term in these stocks. True they could go up a lot more then we think but then we are nearer to a very huge capacity expansion in cement (FY 09). Let us see what happens but normally it would make sense to have some predefined targets in mind and switch over to something else once this flow gathers steam.

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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 10/Oct/2006 at 7:41pm
thanks basantji,
i too was thinking on the same lines.
planning to wait for may be six more months or rs.300,whichever comes earlier...and to keep close watch on the sector outlook all the time.
lets see what happens.
regards,
sun


Posted By: s_praharaj
Date Posted: 10/Oct/2006 at 8:02pm
 Its really nice to see Rain Commodities going up everyday and real credit goes to Basant for spotting it at the the most appropriate time.
 
The cement boom will show  the best figures in FY07 results. This may continue till first quarter of FY08.There is a huge capacity addition going on.The capacity addition is to the tune of 70.6 million tonnes till FY09. If the infrastructure devolopment, common wealth games, SEZs etc also are taken into accounts, the demand will grow by 10% per annum. The Cement production will be 158 mt in 2006, 166mt in 2007, 185 in 2008 and 226 in 2009.Taking the growth in demand cement production will be more by approx 15% in 2009. From the first quarter of 2008, the supply will exceed the demand and the margin will fall.
 
Further the the supply will exceed more in south than the north and the south will experience the glut in cement earlier than the north.
 
Taking all the above into consideration, Rain Commodities with its ration will further moveup till June 2008.
 
I think it will be wise to move out of all the cement stock between April 2007 and September2007.
 
Long back during the public issue I was allotted 200 shares of Priyadarshini Cements. I kept it for three years and sold it for Rs.5.00. This the reason I did not take the call of Basant, when he recommended it for 111.00.
 
Great recommendation in the appropriate time.
 
Hearty Congratulations Basant,


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Shashi Praharaj


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 10/Oct/2006 at 8:06pm
Thank you so much. I am very fearful and poor on cyclicals. I am trying to do a write up on how we could be closer (sticking my neck out) to end of the cement boom (in terms of stcok prices) but it just does not seem to happen. Shall do it ASAP.

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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: patnitin
Date Posted: 10/Oct/2006 at 9:40am
Hello Mr.Basant,
 
Probably I have asked this question earlier too but not received your reply.I hold Rain calcining since last two years,bought very low.Now should I wait till the merger is finalised or book my profits.What's your gut feeling ,whether it would benefit the sharholders of rain cal?
I understand that Rain cal is also in a niche business and a captive power plant of about 40MW with excess power available with them which they give to other inds.


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 10/Oct/2006 at 10:06am

Sorry if I missed it earlier but I would have no idea on Rain Calcining company is into a good business as you say but other then that I would have no clue except that mergers create synergies and generally lead to higher prices. (This is more of a generalised view).



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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 07/Nov/2006 at 7:08pm
Hi Basantji,
 
Q2 of rain commodities(available in their website priyacementdotcom), seems to be in line with expectations.
 
your views?
 
regards,
sun.


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 07/Nov/2006 at 7:18pm
All cement companies came out with phenomenal results look at India Cement still prices of some moved while others have not. This could have a message - let us see what happens but personally being no cement expert I think that Rain is closer to being fully valued at Rs 200 then otherwise. Synergies created by merger could take the price up a bit more but that will take a more macro call.
 
The easiest (toughest) thing in cement and steel is that one company's results can be predicted to find out how the other has dones so things get factored in very easily.
 
The steam is surely left but as I like using the phrase  this is only skimmed milk; the cream is perhaps the margin of safety that the early investor is sitting on.


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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: kulman
Date Posted: 07/Nov/2006 at 7:30pm
Hmmm...that skimmed milk theory reminds me of CIGAR BUTT theory mentioned by Buffet in http://video.google.com.au/videoplay?docid=-6231308980849895261&q=warren+buffett - see Warren Buffett speak video link posted by BubbleVision
 
 


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Life can only be understood backwards—but it must be lived forwards


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 07/Nov/2006 at 7:46pm
So Basantji,
Is it sensible to get out at 200, instead of our earlier target of 300?


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 07/Nov/2006 at 7:49pm
Yes, if you can find a better idea.But there is no panic as such.
 
Kulmanji: Those cigar butts were avialble for free here skimmed c\milk could take away a fortune.


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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: kulman
Date Posted: 07/Nov/2006 at 7:53pm
Oh oh oh....Sorry for the error on my part.
 
 


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Life can only be understood backwards—but it must be lived forwards


Posted By: India_Bull
Date Posted: 08/Nov/2006 at 8:01pm

Basantji,

This is my nonperforming stock at the moment, would it test the patience to cross 200 ?
 
 


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India_Bull forever Bull !
www.kapilcomedynights.com


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 08/Nov/2006 at 8:12pm
There is nothing wrong with this co. just that the extent of undervaluation at Rs 114 seems to have played itself out for the early investors.

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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 24/Nov/2006 at 6:32pm
Basantji,
 
What is wrong with the news of promoters issuing preferential warrants at 200 to themselves?. The stock is weak nowadays. May be due to concerns about equity dilution?
 
Or is there any adverse development that i am unaware of?. As far as I have searched , there is no such news.
 
Your view basantji?


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 24/Nov/2006 at 6:39pm
Preferential offers are always bad but then everyone does it so nothing serious there. AT Rs 200 aplacement does not amount to stealing from shareholders and is better then those who do it at discount to market price.

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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 24/Nov/2006 at 6:48pm
Amazing speed basantji!!
 
It seems like a messenger-chat basantji!!
 
Would you advise me to hold on till 200?.Or shall i exit now?
 
BTW, all your recommendations have gone up, up and away, and i am wondering what to buy if i exit now.. I like viceroy, and I believe that i can get it lower during the next correction.
 
Thanks, wishes and regards,
 
sun.


Posted By: India_Bull
Date Posted: 24/Nov/2006 at 7:19pm
Yes.
 
Hats off to Basantji,
 
 I have added few stocks after I joined this board and they are doing well (except rain commodities )and I am convinced they will do well or rather give me an opportunity to add more in case of correction..
 
Basantji, why dont you start a Mutual Fund or a sort of common fund (Just an idea at the moment) and the board members like me who believe in your vision and analytical thinking will be a part of this venture ?
 
I read a story about some villagers in Gujrat who have come together, they contribute to a common fund which is managed by a wise person and they collectively decide and buy only shares of a single company for months together and distribute the profits... they are doing very well since last 2 yrs


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India_Bull forever Bull !
www.kapilcomedynights.com


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 24/Nov/2006 at 8:36pm
Sandeep,
 
congrats on your century!
 
what a way to bring up your century!...a very innovative idea indeed.
 
but i wonder if basantji would  accept the idea...we should be careful not to embarass a busy man like him.
 
regards,
 
sun.


Posted By: India_Bull
Date Posted: 24/Nov/2006 at 8:44pm
Thanks...
 
Though the idea looks not feasible at the initial glance , if many people come together , it brings the power with the collective money ..I cant buy 10000 shares of a company alone whose future I think is bright ...
 
 


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India_Bull forever Bull !
www.kapilcomedynights.com


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 24/Nov/2006 at 9:14pm
Yes...the idea is attractive to contemplate. But it requires a team of investors with reasonable wisdom, commonsense, and above all, faith.
 
It also requires a pro-active,intelligent, and analytical leader with thorough knowledge of the markets.
 
We can safely assume that we have the latter in basantji.Can we put the former in place, before this utopian dream takes shape?
 
regards,
 
sun.
 
 


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 24/Nov/2006 at 9:37am
Sun: Viceroy looks good to me as a strong, solid long term play on the Indian hotels space. The other one is obviously Indian Hotels but the rewards in Viceroy will be higher since the risks are higher.
 
About that MF thing not sure if we have all that it takes to run a fund and in an MF people do not share ideas they share wealth, here we are sharing ideas to make wealth. I like this mode where each of the partiipant is free to ake his or her hoice and we are very early into this forum but as they say morning shows the day!!!


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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 25/Nov/2006 at 9:35pm
Yes basantji,
 
The whole concept of equity desk is exciting because it offers a basket of  well researched ideas  from which one is free to choose some that suit his/her style of investing.
 
Also, this forum is undoubtedly blessed with a great admin and some of the best members you could find.When the collective wisdom of such investors adorns a platform, it changes the investing style of  beginners like me.
 
To me, this is the greatest service basantji has done to us!
 
Teaching fishing to a man is a better service than feeding him with a fish.
 
Running an MF is like feeding us with fish. But Basantji is making us better fishermen!!
 
Thanks to basantji.
 
sun. 


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 06/Dec/2006 at 10:54pm
Rain commodities is planning to increase the FII limits.
 
Basantji, your comments invited.
 
Hope junior basant and bhabiji are doing well.
 
Regards,
 
SUN


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 07/Dec/2006 at 6:24pm
Your thoughts, Basantji?


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 09/Dec/2006 at 2:30pm
Increasing FII limits bring short term upsides nothing changes fundamentally though.

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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 16/Jan/2007 at 3:08pm
Hi basantji,
 
Completely exited this counter today at 205.... a return of 77%.
 
Thanks a lot basantji!
 
Regards,
 
SUN.


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 16/Jan/2007 at 3:26pm
Hi!
Great to hear thatClap. Did not see you on the forum of late.


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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: mintoo
Date Posted: 16/Jan/2007 at 4:56pm

If i am sure of the wavecounts then probably a new bull wave started in rain commodities where it might hit 340-350,whats ur view mr. basant as far as the fundamentals are concerned ,can 350 be supported by its intrinsic fundamentals.



Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 16/Jan/2007 at 6:05pm
350 is not something that intrinsic value would indicate.

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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: mintoo
Date Posted: 16/Jan/2007 at 6:43pm

may be ,but p/e factor is a subjective concept don't you think so,cement cycle is gaining momentum, prices on bourses are often far from reality.



Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 16/Jan/2007 at 8:50pm
Yes basantji, sorry for not participating in forum discussions of late.
 
I was watching from the sidelines sir.
 
What mintoo is saying may be true, but i subscribe to your view that we may be at the top of the cement boom right now, and I decided "to leave somthing on the table and leave", as you would put it.
 
I think mintoo is invested in the scrip, and wish him well. My  feeling is that there is some upside left in the counter, although not as high as 350.
 
I will be a regular boarder hereafter!
 
Regards,
 
sun.


Posted By: mintoo
Date Posted: 16/Jan/2007 at 12:01pm
ya buddy i have an interest in the scrip but  it may not be wise to be patient for 6 months and book profit in panic.anyway stock closing at a new high on a day when market is choppy are always signs of an outperformer and whatever news ,results about a particular scrip in a market is there is not exhaustive,there may be good investments by the co. in form of anything from private equity to gold or anything,we can never expect the market to behave in the manner we think it should be , as bhaiya always say makets are not taught they have to be learnt,though i hold the stock from the levels of 75 but i still feel its time to add more rather than sell coz' i think trained eyes will see some big fireworks in the stock soon.


Posted By: sun_1313
Date Posted: 23/Jan/2007 at 7:39pm

See mr.mintoo, the stock is more than 12% down within 10 days after i booked profit.

Are you adding more, or revising your targets?

regards,
 
sun.


Posted By: Mohan
Date Posted: 10/Feb/2007 at 11:00am
I see Rain at Rs 10. Is that right ?
Did the stock split ?


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Be fearful when others are greedy and be greedy when others are fearful.


Posted By: patnitin
Date Posted: 04/Jun/2007 at 12:25pm
Rain Calcining
 
Basantji,Does the recent announcement regarding US acquisition alter the way we see at this company.
I hold it from Rs 7 levels in the hope that value of its power plant and supposedly latest technology etc..would unlock some day.But its impending merger with Rain commodities has had a negative effect.What are your views on this?


Posted By: basant
Date Posted: 04/Jun/2007 at 12:41pm
Since you have made a multibagger out of this I would suggest you listen to no one on this company. You have followed it more closely then me but Rain commodities was a stock that I felt had done away with its rally and that is why I wrote on that thread that we should be booking profits. RC - I have no idea!

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'The Thoughtful Investor: A Journey to Financial Freedom Through Stock Market Investing' - A Book on Equity Investing especially for Indian Investors. Book your copy now: www.thethoughtfulinvestor.in


Posted By: ars1769
Date Posted: 05/Jul/2007 at 2:53pm
Rain commodities 500339
IT is south india based company , where demand groth is highest of 31 % and inventry levels negative
IT has 1.5 million tonne capacity which is going to be doubled at 3 in this october 2007
citibank is holding 15% stake which will add comfort vis avis quality of investors
Its consolitated EPS is 47 and expected eps is 90+ this year
Rain calcining a group company is going to merge with it in the ratio of 3.5:1
 
Basantji, what P.E. should be given to Raincommodities?
 


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amit


Posted By: PKB2000
Date Posted: 09/Oct/2007 at 12:16pm
I have heard that Rain commo and Rain calcining will be together in some day. The swap ratio is 2:7. Considering present valuation (Rain cal- ~43) and Rai com ( ~170) if one wish to buy stocks in the cement sector then can Rain cal be a better option?
Also wish to know if the merger news is confirmed or not? And is it good to buy the stock in cement sectors especially Rain cal or rain com?


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I am always doing that which I cannot do, in order that I may learn how to do it. ~Pablo Picasso


Posted By: prabhakarkudva
Date Posted: 03/Sep/2009 at 5:56pm
Is this company also into selling carbon credits?

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Take your chances and keep them in a box until a quieter time.



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